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Thread: Rain damage to honda accord seat, hydrator help

  1. #1
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    Default Rain damage to honda accord seat, hydrator help

    Hello,
    A few years ago I left my sun roof open and my Honda's seat leather was damaged. There was a piece of paper on the seat that got soaked and it stayed wet on the seat for more than a day. Pic attached.

    I ordered the water damage and stiffness restoration kit here: https://leatherdoctor.com/auto-leath...on-kit-at5-ws/

    I think I've followed the directions. I didn't have much acidifier because most of it spilled in shipping (it was graciously replaced and was in the mail when I started), but I had enough for one spray application after using the cleaner. I sprayed on the acidifier and then wiped it off and the towel was clean, so I proceeded to the hydrator.

    Its now nearing 72 hours with the hydrator applied via wetted towels under plastic wrap. I'm nearly out of product and the rain damaged hard spots appear unchanged and still hard. Did I do something wrong? What should I do next?

    Thanks,
    Grant

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  2. #2
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    >>> What should I do next?

    Did you apply any physical action to soften it?

    This is a copy and paste from the instruction . . .

    2.11: The entire panel should have a darkening effect with full hydration beneath the finishing coating to allow massaging/flexing/stretching of the shrunk area to softness without a dry line.

    2.13: Sitting over a plastic sheet with movement also helps to improve overall appearance, while it is kept fully hydrated.

    2.18: In summary, Hydrator 3.3 has to soften the leather with physical manipulation of any type until softness is achieved before applying Fatliquor 5.0 and repeating fatliquor application and manipulation to dry soften the leather.

    Let me know, if you need clarification with the above instructions.

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    Roger Koh
    Leather Care System Formulator
    Consultant / Practitioner / Instructor / Coach
    web: www.leatherdoctor.com
    forum: www.leathercleaningrestorationforum.com
    email: [email protected],
    email: [email protected]
    phone: 604 773 1878
    Last edited by Roger Koh; 4 Weeks Ago at 07:27 AM.

  3. #3
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    Auto Leather Water and Heat Damaged Stiffness Restoration Kit AT5.ws
    https://leatherdoctor.com/auto-leath...on-kit-at5-ws/

    Auto Leather Water and Heat Damaged Stiffness Restoration Kit AT5.ws by Leather Doctor is to clean, rinse, and soften leather stiffness caused by water and heat.

    A holistic system to restore leather stiffness with Kit AT5.ws comprises of 3 Steps.

    Step 1: Restoration Cleaning and pH Balancing is performed with Leather Pro Cleaner 1.5 and Leather Acidifier 2.0.

    Step 2: Hydrating and Softening is performed with Leather Hydrator 3.3 and Leather Fatliquor 5.0.

    Step 3: Rub-resistant non-stick protection is performed with Leather Protector B.

    Tools: Leather Brush 1, Foam Brush 2, and Towel 5.

    1: Description - Leather Pro Cleaner 1.5 and Leather Acidifier 2.0 system!

    1.1: Cleaner 1.5 and Acidifier 2.0 holistic working systems are developed to clean foreign contamination and rectify leather denaturing from turning sticky or slimy.

    1.2: Acidifier 2.0 is used as a rinse and a pH balancer for a healthy squeaky feel.

    1.3: Cleaner 1.5 and Acidifier 2.0 system ensures that surface soiling is first removed and leather pH neutralized before proceeding to the next step of Hydrator 3.3 and Fatliquor 5.0 system.

    1.4: Cleaner 1.5 is a water-based pH value 1.5 restorative cleaner with an extra protonating or pH balancing function for all leathers and suedes types.

    1.5: Cleaner 1.5 works by increasing the ionic positive (+ve) attraction of the amphoteric leather protein fiber to hydrogen bond with its other ionic negative (-ve) leather constituents like the tanning agent and fatliquor more effectively.

    1.6: Acidifier 2.0 is a water-based pH 2.0 rinse and pH-balancer for alkaline damages manifest as marks, streaks, brightness, and tackiness.

    1.7: Instruction - How to Work with Cleaner 1.5 and Acidifier 2.0 system?

    1.8: Cleaner 1.5 is applied and worked with a detailing brush and towel extracted until the new folding side shows clean.

    1.9: Acidifier 2.0 is applied and worked with a detailing brush and towel extracted until the new folding side is clean and dry. And is ready for hydration.

    2: Description - Hydrator 3.3 and Fatliquor 5.0 system!

    2.1: Hydrator 3.3 and Fatliquor 5.0 work in sync in fatliquor reconditioning as a system to return leather from stiffness.

    2.2: Hydrator 3.3 is a water-based pH 3.3 relaxing conditioner with multi-functional abilities both on the surface and within the leather structure.

    2.3: Hydrator 3.3 structural penetrating ability will require saturating leather to an optimum level with moisture oozing out when gently pressed between thumb and fingers.

    2.4: Its surface cleaning ability is to remove fatliquor dry sticky residue.

    2.5: Fatliquor 5.0 conditioner is a micro-emulsion of fat, oil, and water for reconditioning and restoring leather, and suede to their original suppleness, from weakness and stiffness.

    2.6: Fatliquor 5.0 fat content plumps the leather with fullness from easily collapsing into creases and wrinkles during stress or flex, while the oil content lubricates the fibers so that they slide over one another smoothly like millions of interconnecting hinges.

    2.7: Fatliquor 5.0 helps to keep leather at its optimum physical performance and prevent premature aging.

    2.8: Fatliquor 5.0 softens the leather when dry with stretchability, compressibility, and flexibility while enhancing its rip tensile strength greatly.

    2.9: Instruction - How to Work with Hydrator 3.3 and Fatliquor 5.0 systems?

    2.10: Hydrator 3.3 is applied and brushed through the perforated or stitching holes following the path of water damage and beyond with no dry lines within a panel.

    2.11: The entire panel should have a darkening effect with full hydration beneath the finishing coating to allow massaging/flexing/stretching of the shrunk area to softness without a dry line.

    2.12: Any ridge line, vein, or wrinkle developed at the edge is worked through a plastic sheet to reduce abrasion to the finishes when a smooth spatula or spoon is used.

    2.13: Sitting over a plastic sheet with movement also helps to improve overall appearance, while it is kept fully hydrated.

    2.14: With appearance and softness satisfaction while the leather is still damp, fatliquor reconditioning may commence.

    2.15: Fatliquor 5.0's objective is to follow the penetrating path of Hydrator 3.3 with continued massaging and allow slow drying of the evaporated water content, more is applied until the last application the leather absorbed no more.

    2.16: Hydrator 3.3 is used to clean up any surface residue.

    2.17: When the leather is almost dry, sitting movement over a towel until the leather dries ensures leather retains its softness with strength.

    2.18: In summary, Hydrator 3.3 has to soften the leather with physical manipulation of any type until softness is achieved before applying Fatliquor 5.0 and repeating fatliquor application and manipulation to dry soften the leather.

    3: Description - Protector B Plus system!

    3.1: Protector B Plus is a non-film-forming surface protective conditioner with a non-stick soft buttery feel which reduces leather squeaking noise that translates to increased leather resistance to wet and dry rubs thus reducing stretch, scuff, and abrasion, with a classic leather scent.

    3.2: Instruction - How to Work with Protector-B system?

    3.3: Shake well, mist spray, and spread with a lint-free towel padding and it is ready to use when dry.

    People Also Ask:

    4: What is Leather?

    5: Why Water Damage Leather?

    6: Why Heat Damage Leather?

    7: What is Leather Stiffness?

    8: How to Restore Leather from Stiffness when Wet?

    9: How to Restore Leather from Stiffness when Dry?

    10: How to Saturate the Leather Structure Below the Finishes?

    11: How to Ease Conditioners Penetration?

    12: How to Move the Conditioners to Spread out the entire Panel?

    13: What Can be Done with Finishes Damages?

    4: What is Leather?

    4.1: Leather is an amphoteric protein fiber material that is pH sensitive and any liquid that has a pH value above the pH neutral of leather will cause the leather constituent, especially the fatliquor fat and oil content to leach out.

    5: Why Water Damage Leather?

    5.1: Water's average pH value is about 7, while leather's pH neutral is about 3 to 5.

    5.2: Any liquid source that has a pH value above 7 will cause the leather protein fiber to weaken its ionic positive (+ve) charges.

    5.3: As the main leather constituents like the tanning agents and fatliquor are ionic negative (-ve), the hydrogen bonds weaken and the fat and oil migrate out, emptying out the center of alkaline overexposure.

    6: Why Heat Damage Leather?

    6.1: When heat is present during the accelerated leather drying process with insufficient fat and oil present, it causes the leather fibrils to become stick together due to the 'Van der Waal' phenomenon.

    7: What is Leather Stiffness?

    7.1 Leather stiffness is due to the lack of fat that separates the fibers from sticking together stiff and oil that lubricates the fibrils like millions of interlocking hinges for flexibility.

    8: How to Restore Leather from Stiffness when Wet?

    8.1: Leather stiffness is relaxed by hydrating the thickness of the leather structure separating them and reversing the shrinkage by massaging/stretching/flexing without a dry edge.

    8.2: When suppleness of the leather is achieved with dimensional satisfaction during the wet process, fatliquor reconditioning begins.

    8.3: Otherwise, when all water content evaporates without fat and oil, the leather reverts back stiff again.

    9: How to Restore Leather from Stiffness when Dry?

    9.1: Fatliquor is the lifeblood of leather!

    9.2: Without the fat and oil, the leather loses its practical usage, becomes stiff and when flexed will crack.

    9.3: Loss of fat and oil will need to be replaced with ionic negative (-ve) charged micro-emulsion fat and oil.

    9.4: Upon contact with the millions of ionic positive (+ve) charged fibrils the water-encased fat and oil break free, hydrogen bond takes place and the water evaporates leaving a breathing space.

    9.5: Repeat fatliquoring continue each cycle water evaporates until the last application leather absorbed no more.

    9.6: Although leather is already dry of water, it is the fat and oil content remaining that keeps the leather soft and strong, with all surface residues removed with Hydrator 3.3.

    10: How to Saturate the Leather Structure Below the Finishes?

    10.1: Hydrator 3.3 is used as a preconditioner to penetrate the leather structure, more easily from the reverse suede side, otherwise follows where the water has seeped in from the surface and is typically along stitching holes between panels.

    10.2: Hydrator 3.3 need to follow the water that has gone through the holes and moves sideways.

    10.3: Hydrator 3.3 need to follow beyond the path of water damage to even out and redistribute fugitive tanning agents and fatliquor.

    10.4: Massaging, stretching helps to saturate and relax stiff leather before following with fatliquoring.

    11: How to Ease Conditioners Penetration?

    11.1: Perforated leather is easier to work with as there are more holes for products to penetrate, a bamboo toothpick could be used to standardize shrunk holes back to size or stitch holes on smooth leather.

    12: How to Move the Conditioners to Spread out the entire Panel?

    12.1: The practical method is by hand over a plastic sheet to reduce friction rubs to the leather finishes spreading out the conditioners, another practical method is sitting movement over a plastic sheet while the conditioners are being applied with less effort to spread them out.

    13: What Can be Done with Finishes Damages?

    13.1: Finishing damage repairs is the second phase based on satisfaction of the first phase of stiffness restoration success.

    13.2: Depending on the severity of shrinkage in question, where a new color refinishing is deemed inevitable, it will require a related refinishing kit to accomplish the finish restoration.

    13.3: Embossing damages become permanent and are not practical to recreate without pressure, heat, and an embossing plate.

    13.4: Shriveled finishes may be too delicate to work during the stretching to relax it and may result in de-lamination.

    13.5: In such a situation the entire damaged panel finish may be shaved with Razor-60 for ease of relaxing the leather structure with hydrating is recommended.

  4. #4
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    May 2024
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Koh View Post
    >>> What should I do next?

    Did you apply any physical action to soften it?
    I have a sack of clothes sitting on it during the day, and I've been sitting on it while I worked on my headliner. Should I do something else?

  5. #5
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    >>> Should I do something else?

    Yes, all the physical manipulation you can think of, for example:

    1. Thumb manipulation,

    2. Knuckle with deep stretching massage.

    3. Using tools like a tablespoon.

    4. Vibrating handtools.

    The stiffness requires a physical break-in before continuing with fatliquoring.

    By the way, the of the leather structure averages 0.9 to 1.5 mm in thickness that requires to be soften up first with hydration, physical softening up then follows with fatliquoring, following the same physical manipulation.

    If the hydrator is used up, use the fatliquor and continue the physical manipulation.

    Let us know what physical manipulation you have done so far.
    Last edited by Roger Koh; 4 Weeks Ago at 11:11 AM.

  6. #6
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    I just did about 20 minutes of thumb and knuckle manipulation and it is softening up. The surface still looks about the same but it is much softer. I will keep going with the manipulation. Should I expect the surface to start returning to its previous appearance or will it need to be scraped and re-dyed?

  7. #7
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    >>> Should I expect the surface to start returning to its previous appearance or will it need to be scraped and re-dyed?

    This Auto Leather Water and Heat Damaged Stiffness Restoration Kit AT5.ws only restore the leather "stiffness".

    The embossed appearance will need an embossing heat and pressure plating as a sheet of material, which is impractical.

    Damaged finishing is refinished with:
    Auto Leather Color Refinishing Kit Ap7.cl
    https://leatherdoctor.com/auto-leath...ng-kit-ap7-cl/

    Based on your experience, '20 minutes of thumb and knuckle manipulation and it is softening up' is the most practical approach?

    Do you have pictures of the result to share your experience?

  8. #8
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    Here are some pictures of the results. The surface damage seems to have extended in a few areas, but the areas of stiffness seem better. Also the luster of the leather is diminished compared to the driver seat now.
    I outlined the areas of surface damage that continues. I read the directions on the "Auto Leather Color Refinishing Kit". Will stripping and refinishing the surface remove those areas of surface damage?
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  9. #9
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    >>> The surface damage seems to have extended in a few areas, but the areas of stiffness seem better.

    The objective of this Kit AT5.ws system is to restore the leather stiffness.

    The secondary consideration is to even out the appearance which could be further worked out if desired.


    >>> Also the luster of the leather is diminished compared to the driver seat now.

    The product system is not able to remove the topcoat that determines its luster.

    Most probably, the luster could be accumulated soiling and aging conditioners used that have been removed.

    Accumulated soiling including aging conditions sometimes are mistaken for its gloss luster.

    Degreasing and rinsing will remove foreign appearance if the topcoat is still intact.

    The luster could be refinished using Leather Topcoat 54 which comes in Gloss, Satin, or Matte to match accordingly.
    https://leatherdoctor.com/leather-topcoat-54/


    >>> I outlined the areas of surface damage that continues.

    Kit AT5.ws system recommends that the damaged areas be extended to a hidden edge if possible to even out appearance.


    >>> I read the directions on the "Auto Leather Color Refinishing Kit". Will stripping and refinishing the surface remove those areas of surface damage?

    Extending the damaged appearance is a better option.

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