Can Tire Marks be Removed from this Coral Red Premium Leather of a 2008 BMW 328i, coupe?

Can you please let me know if your products will remove tire marks on leather seats of my car?
It is not dirt.
It is from tire rubber.
Will leather Ink & Dye Stain removal Starter Kit do the job?

Here are some pictures.
Tires were in the car for 3 days in dark garage but then I transported them for installation and the car was sitting on the direct sunlight with the tires inside for about 7 hours.
I already tried to clean it as you can see on some part.
Basically there are 3 separate marks on 3 different places.
The leather is Coral Red premium leather for 2008 BMW 328i, coupe.
So the leather is 4 years old.
The tires were my first passengers sitting in the back seats since I bought the car.

Please let me know what your suggestion is and what the % possibility of removing these marks successfully is.
The question I have is when I start the process can I resume it later.
I am busy during the week so only possible time is from Friday evening to Sunday evening.
Or I can start any working day right after work but I won’t be able to check the progress until next day evening.

About the products I have used, BMW leather cleaner, soapy water, alcohol (nail polish removal), WD-40 and HONDA cleaner.
I only tried it on center arm rest so
Just in case of damaging the leather surface I can buy the OEM replacement part.

Ok, let’s do it then.
I was concerned because I read the link with the plastic bag issue and every 4 hours you asked the guy to check the progress.
If I don’t overdo it to let the application work while I am at work then I am ready.
Anyway first I’ll apply it on the center arm console so if any damage occurs I can buy the replacement part.
That’s the mark (my starting point) which I am resending now, (if you rotate the picture 90 degrees you’ll see the damage on the right).

Please let me know.

Dusan.


#A
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...008BMW328i.jpg


#B
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...tire-marks.jpg


#1
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...REstain-10.jpg


#2
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...REstain-11.jpg


#3
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...REstain-12.jpg


#4
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...REstain-13.jpg


#5
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...IREstain-7.jpg


#6
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...IREstain-8.jpg


#7
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...IREstain-9.jpg


#8
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...IREstain-6.jpg

Let me know when you are ready to start with this Kit Ap5.di

http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/n...r/KitAp5di.jpg
Leather Doctor® - Auto Pigmented Leather – Topcoat Refinisher - Dye and Ink Stain Remover - Kit Ap5.di

Roger Koh
[email protected]

Let start at the partially damaged “center arm console”.

Take note the technical difficulty when working on a vertical panel as the Prep-7.7 tends to flow downwards.

1] Apply Prep-7.7 to stain avoiding the damaged areas.

2] Cut out the paper rag slightly oversize, place over it and allowing the Prep-7.7 to wet through; otherwise add onto the paper rag.

3] You may want to place extra dry paper rag beneath just to catch any drips and cling wrapped it.

4] Check at the end of each day and change the paper rag with new application for the next 3 days and see the progressive result each day if any. This is plan A before going into plan B.

Show some pictures of the application, otherwise it may be better to remove the seat and doing it horizontally.

Roger Koh
[email protected]

Hi Roger

I've decided to remove back seats and lay it down on the flat surface so the application wont drip. I'll update you with my progress.

Hello Roger
Here are some pictures after removing seats and applying Prep7.7. Please let me know if the application amount is sufficient.
DusanAttachment 829Attachment 830

Dusan,

How long was the Prep-7.7 left to dwell on the stain?

Do you think the Prep-7.7 has move the stain?

Do you see any color of the leather on the paper rag?

Tips:
Do tests on a hidden area – cut a dime size paper rag, soak with Prep-7.7 and let it dwell to test out the strength of the leather finish.

Do the same size tests over the tire stain and compare the result.

The paper rag for the stain shown in picture #1 is too much oversize. The purpose of the cut out paper rag is to hold the Prep-7.7 over the stain; absorb the suspended stain instead of staying on the leather surface. When it becomes stain from the reverse transfer, a fresh on is replace until the stain is fully exhausted. If leather finish color shows on the paper rag , stop; if the leather darkens upon application, stop and clean off with Cleaner-3.8 follows with Rinse-3.0. Leather pH is further neutralized with Acidifier-2.0 by soaking it over with another cut out paper rag and dwell until it dries, testing with Acidifier-2.0 with finger should have a squeaky feel.

Try to take better picture, so I know exactly what’s going on.


Do a test on the damaged areas with a cut out (dime size), soak with Hydrator-3.3 and leave it on to observe if the leather darkens (easier to show pictures, please)?


Roger

Hello Roger
Answers to your questions.

How long was the Prep-7.7 left to dwell on the stain?
6 hours

Do you think the Prep-7.7 has move the stain?
Not at all

Do you see any color of the leather on the paper rag?
Not at all

After 6 hours the oversize paper rag was completely dry and leather also. I cut a dime size rag and applied Prep-7.7 on the tire stain area. Here is the picture.
Interior lights and iPhone4 is not a good combination when taking picture. Please let me know if you have any suggestions I already tried many angles and flash no flash
combinations.
Attachment 832

Tips:

1] Apply Prep-7.7 over the paper rag to wet it through.

2] Apply a cling wrapper (kitchen food film) over the application without touching it (you can raise the film around the application with a ring of paper rag or a hole out Styrofoam).

3] Purpose for the raise cling wrapper over the application is to control evaporation.

4] The same spot need a continuous dwell up to 72hours to conclude its effectiveness.

5] What we are doing at this stage is using the “reverse transferring” technique for the stain to back-up onto the damp paper rag.

6] With the evaporation control I believe the Prep-7.7 will stay longer, thus reducing your inspection time.

7] Before reapplying at every inspection period, use a forceps to remove the paper rag to inspect the leather finish as well – see that it looks normal with no swelling.


Roger Koh
[email protected]

Hello Roger

Please look at the picture, it looks like leather is melting. Is that a good sign? It seems like the tire mark looks like gone. Another picture is with the cling wrap.
Attachment 833Attachment 834

1] The picture with the plastic cling wrap looks good, the paper rag is well soak with Prep-7.7 and I believe it is also raised without the cling wrapped touching it.
Is this picture the "before"?

2] If the "tire mark looks like gone"; do not do any rubbing to the surface, blot out the excess of the Prep-7.7 with paper rag.
Spray Cleaner-3.8 blot and gently agitate using the horsehair Brush-3 to remove those in the valley of the grain.
Follow with Rnse-3.0 blot and brush agitates, and blots off the remaining foam.

pH Balance
3] Spray Acidifier-2.0 and blot off remaining residue.
Cut out a strip of paper rag with double fold, soak with Acidifier-2.0 cling wrapped it again and leave it to dwell double the time used for the Prep-7.7.
This will control the swelling if any, returning back to normal.
Thereafter check if it looks normal and the feel should be squeaky as well, same as the surrounding areas.

Let's see some pictures if you are doing it right.

How long was the dwell time for the Prep-7.7 for picture #1


Roger Koh
[email protected]

Hello Roger
Please see the picture taken today. The tire mark is still there and black spots showed up over night.
Dusan
Attachment 835

The black spots after 24hrs dwelling and the Hydrator-3.3 testing shows that the finish topcoat has been removed or damaged, the Hydrator-3.3 and the Prep-7.7 has produced a darkening effect. Both of these marks will return to normal, the hydrator will be faster, while the Prep-7.7 sticky residue has to be removed by Cleaner-3.8 follows by Rinse-3.0, thereafter when dry will return to normal.

We may abandon those weak and damaged areas for such as test, instead work on strong areas so that we may apply the success to the other two areas.

As for the 24hrs test, you may proceed for another 48hrs to see if the stain is reverse transferred without further damages to the leather would be ideal (the finish topcoat I believe has been removed, if the stain is out finally I hope, then re-topcoating will return the finish to normal again, if there is not much of an initial color change or loss).

The white as shown in the Prep-7.7 in progress is either there is air spaces or not sufficient of Prep-7.7. The cut-out paper rag has to be tight in order to reverse transfer the stain, just like how the tire was compressed onto the leather surface tight that cause the “carbon” to migrate to the leather. The whole idea is to reverse the situation, now instead of the tire; we are using the Prep-7.7 saturated paper-rag. It took time for the first migration; similarly we have to take the similar amount of time for the reverse migration.

Hello Roger

I am uploading some pictures to compare before and after. Let me know what's the next step as I believe the center console is 85% cleaned and I dont think Prep-7.7 can do more with it. It has been more over 72 hours of dwelling. Second set of pictures showing that even after 72 hours of dwelling the tire mark in the black rectangular is removed minimally. Is it because of different type of leather? The third set is the last tire mark which seems to be disappearing quickly.

Attachment 836

Attachment 837

Before and After
Attachment 838

The difference may be due to some unknown products used prior, that may have altered the characteristic of the stain in relation to the leather.

Since you are quite confident in what you are doing, I recommend proceeding doing all areas taking note of their total dwelling time

As for the console, if the finish is still in good condition (without swelling) than we can continue for another 72hrs of effective (tight) dwelling.

Roger Koh
[email protected]

Hello Roger

Please look at the picture bellow. You can see before and after pictures of damaged center console. On after picture the leather got swollen after I applied first Cleaner-3.8 , Rinse-3.0. Leather pH and then I neutralized with Acidifier-2.0 for 24 hours. My question is can I recover it or it is damaged for good? Why these white spots? Did I brush too hard to remove Prep-7.7 and made more damage? In meantime I applied Acidifier-2.0 for another 48 hours as you mentioned in previous post that the time should be doubled from Prep-7.7. Please let me know your thoughts.
Thank you Dusan

Attachment 841

Swollen Leather:

The leather swell is due to uneven tension from the liquid solution absorbed through the darkening effect due to the loss of topcoat; it will revert to original tension once all moisture dries up. Otherwise I will explain how to hotplate it to even out the tension.


White Spots:
These white spots were originally there, but this close-up picture reveal that they are the damaged topcoat that is peeling. This damaged topcoat should be removed, by Brush-1, Eraser-4 and Sandpaper 2000 and thereafter, new topcoat applied, the white spot should be gone. We deal with this last after the swelling subside and the stain is gone.

Are the stain gone?


Roger Koh
[email protected]

Hello Roger

What would be the plan "B" for the tire marks? I've been patiently applying new film of Prep-7.7 every 72 hours total 2 weeks now on all 3 areas center console, left arm rest and the right back rest. I am running out of Prep-7.7 and marks are still visible. I think we are at the point where Prep-7.7 will not do more magic. I've seen that Prep-7.7 left darkening effect also.
What do you suggest at this point?

Thank you Dusan

Plan “B” is using the bleach as a booster for the Prep-7.7.
This concoction is definitely not to be applied to the darkening effect (becomes absorbent due to weakening of the Topcoat).
I suggest, again a small dot test out on the console or hidden area to see how strong is the color (no way of using it if there is a color change in the test).

I suggest using the Advanced Mix formulation, and save it for subsequent application.
If the black stain is dyestuff, bleach will work, if it is carbon, as mentioned before it may not work.
Bleaching is working on a chemical change to the color, just making it colorless.
Prep-7.7 is working by permanently removing the stain by Penetration, Lubrication and Suspension.
Using the bleach as a booster for the Prep-7.7 is accelerating the removing process with a chemical reaction to the black stain (if it is a dye than a carbon).

See what is left of the Prep-7.7.
Place about half of the amount (in weight) of Bleach-9.9 into the empty bottle.
Add double in weight of the Prep-7.7 and stir to mix.
Add water (hot is optional) using the pipette for adding the same amount as the Prep-7.7 and stir while adding until it turns to a white cream, otherwise leave it for a few minutes.
Use the stirring stick to apply a dot onto hidden areas to see if the color remains unchanged after 6 hours, safe enough for the actual application to the stain area; avoiding pre darkening spots.



Product mixing standard instructions:

Mixing Instructions:
The powder Bleach-9.9 has to be mixed into a creamy paste to be applied onto the dye stains so that it remains on top of the surface, otherwise penetrating onto the leather crust cause denaturing to the leather with a yellow stain. This is done by using non-metal tools to mix with added hot water. Advanced formula includes adding Prep-7.7 for a longer more effective suspending and bleaching effect.

Test:
Test finishes absorbency strength with Hydrator-3.3 (soak a paper-rag cut out and place over stain for 30mins); if it darkens void the bleaching.
Perforated and stitching holes are to be avoided too.

A) Standard Mix:
A.1] The approximate ratio mix is Bleach-9.9 [3] to Hot Water [1].
A.2] For example, weight 9gm of Bleach-9.9 into the empty plastic bottle, then add 3gm of Hot Water using the pipette and stir it up to a creamy paste.

B) Advanced Mix:
B.1] Bleach-9.9 is first mixed with Prep-7.7 and thereafter hot water is added to mix it to a whitish creamy paste.
B.2] The ratio by weight is Bleach-9.9 [1] + Prep-7.7 [2] + Hot Water [2].
B.3] Example of the mix by weight in the bottle may start with Bleach-9.9 [10gm] + Prep-7.7 [20gm]; stir well then add Hot Water [20gm] using the pipette, stir again and leave for 10 minutes or so for it to gel to a whitish creamy paste prior to application.

Technique:
The paste is applied onto the stain, preferably use a cut out paper-rag to place on top; this helps the released stains to be absorbed by the paper-rag instead.
Check every 2 hours to a maximum of 6 hours to see the effect of the bleaching.

Precaution:
Use bleach with caution at your own risk, if the finish becomes absorbent (with a darkening effect) stops the bleaching immediately.
Clean off sticky residue with Cleaner-3.8 follows with Rinse-3.0 until a squeaky feel.
Avoid physical rubbing which may damage the finish during the bleaching process.
Blotting action and light agitation using horsehair Brush-3 is recommended.

pH Neutralization:
Neutralize the area with a soak of Acidifier-2.0 with a cut out paper-rag and leave to dwell.
Change paper when becomes soiled and repeat with double the bleaching time (e.g. a 6 hours bleaching would require a 12 hours neutralizing time).